Twin Talks
Sleep Training For Your Twins

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CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: Like most parents, getting your twins to sleep on a regular routine can be a huge challenge. In desperation to get some sleep yourself, you might be googling sleeping training and finding an overwhelming amount of information on the internet. What is truly effective when it comes to twins? Are there good alternatives to cry it out? When should you start sleep training? Today, we’re talking about sleep training methods for twins. This is Twin Talks.

[Theme Music/Intro]

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: Well, welcome to Twin Talks. Twin Talks is your online on the go support group for expecting and new parents of twins. I'm your host, Christine Stewart Fitzgerald. Have you subscribed to the Twin Talks newsletter? It’s a great way to learn about new episodes when they’re release. If you want episodes automatically, download it to your mobile device and please subscribed our show through iTunes or download the free Twin Talks app. Here is Sunny with details on how you can get involve with Twin Talks.

SUNNY GAULT: All right, so we are recording our shows a little bit differently, and this is a huge benefit for all of our listeners because it makes it easier than ever for you guys to join the conversation. We’re all twin parents and we know how difficult it is just to have a few moments of sanity away from your kids, right? It’s difficult to kind of plan stuff out and so we’ve made it as simple as we possibly can for you guys to join our episode. We record everything now straight from our own computers which a little bit different than what we were doing before where we’re meeting more of a studio type of environment. We have a Facebook group that we post all of our topics and the times that we’re planning to record everything and it’ a great group to join if you’re interested in being part of our shows. And then that way, when we post something, you could just let us know is it’s something you’re interested in, and you literally only need your computer, the Google Chrome internet browser and a good internet speed. If you have those three things, you can join our shows from wherever you’re at whether you’re somewhere in the U.S. or even outside of the U.S. as long as you can access a link that will give you, you can join the shows. It’s a great way to now be part of this conversation and we’re looking forward to having these conversations with twin parents all over the world. That’s a great way that you can participate in our shows.

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: All right. Well, we’ve got a great group of parents with us today. Let’s meet our parents who are joining us and please tell us a little bit about yourself, your family and your experience with today’s topic.

JULES MASS: Hi. I'm Jules Mass. I'm in Seattle Washington. My husband and I have five year old triplet girls. I'm a freelancer with a blog called Massive Miracle. It doesn’t get updated as much as I’d like but my experience with sleep training is one of the nice things about being in the NICU is they put this all in the same room but that put this on a different half hour schedules, so when we came home, there was a baby waking up every 30 minutes which if they you know, every two hours, that means you feed someone, feed someone, feed someone and then you get 20 minutes until the next kid wakes up, so yeah.

SUNNY GAULT: Fun.

JULES MASS: With long process that we tried a lot of things.

CHRISTEL: Hi. I'm Christel. I'm from the Washington D.C. area and I have twins. They’re turning six this month, so we’ve light at the end of the tunnel. Yes, it’s a challenge, the first one two years but this is a good stage. They were in the NICU for just two weeks but like Jules, they were put on a schedule and that schedule was an hour apart. When we got home, we were trying to maintain that but to get a 15 minute break wait for the next feeding starts again. By six weeks, I was running on fumes and needed to figure some stuff out for myself and that’s when we got into. I like the term sleep coaching instead of sleep training. I know we’ll talk about a little bit more in depth about maybe the differences or the philosophies about them.

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: Yes, absolutely. Okay and Gareth. We have our dad with us today.

GARETH MASSEY: My name is Gareth Massey. I am owner of Cozy Babe, the world’s greatest swaddles. I have a single that is four and turning five at the end of April. I have twins. They are turning three at the end of April. The first baby when we got her home, we had her sleeping through the night by four weeks and we’ve had great success keeping a good schedule in getting her in the bed and when we have parties and everything and people always surprise it that she’s able to go down. With the twins, we had them sleeping through the night at six weeks. We have some really great success with being consistent with some of the routine in getting them into bed and so I'm excited to share that with everybody.

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: All right. We’ll turn it over to Sunny.

SUNNY GAULT: Yeah, so I'm Sunny and I'm the owner of New Mommy Media which produces the show, some are our other podcast. I have four kids, two boys, those are my singletons, ages five and three. I have identical twin girls that are about two and a half years old. I will say, as far as sleep is concerned, I'll make it to pretty good sleepers and I know everyone hates me when I say that but, I will say, and I'm not really sure what contributed to this but I think my boys were better sleepers than my girls. Obviously, it’s way different when you have twins and they might be sleeping in the same room and waking each other up and I also breastfeed my twins a lot longer than I breastfeed my boys. I think all of these factors may have come in to it, but overall, I would classify them as pretty good sleepers and can certainly share more about that as we continue with conversation.

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: All right. I'm your host. I'm Christine Stewart Fitzgerald. I have singleton girl who is three and she was little bit of a tough sleeper, I have to say, compare to my twins who are now six years old. I think we took a very managed approach. They were not that bad, thankfully, so sometimes, I have to say I do have empathy for singleton moms who do say, oh, my gosh, you know, I'm not getting any sleep with singletons. I think there are valid points out there.

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SUNNY GAULT: Before we get going with our conversation today, our main discussion about sleep, I did find a news headline that I’d like to share these nice heartwarming stories, these stories that it really would take a miracle in order for something like this to happen and it looks like that’s exactly what happened. There was a mom, it’s a mom. Here name is Jade Ward. At the time she was 23 years old, I believe she’s probably still 23. When she was four years old, she was diagnosed with neuroblastoma which apparently is a pretty aggressive cancer. She underwent a lot of different cancer treatment and if you can imagine a four year old going through all this, obviously some really heavy stuff.

There was concern from her parents even at the young age that this could impact her fertility later in life. She was kind of told growing up that it probably wasn’t going to happen for her. She probably wasn’t going to be able to have kids and so, fast forward, many, many years, and she’s 23 years old or perhaps a little younger than that, meets her husband. Her now husband and they decide they want to have a family, and so, she goes ant talks to fertility specialist and they pretty much say yet, it’s really not going to happen for you. You're not ovulating, and so she kind of gives up on this dream. She still gets married and it’s just one of those again, this is a miracle story that she was feeling really nauseous one morning or maybe several mornings in the row.

Never imagine that she could actually be pregnant but decided to take a pregnancy test just to be certain. Her test came back positive and then, she went in just to confirm the pregnancy, so probably couple weeks later or whatever, few weeks. They originally told her that she was having twins, and she was super-duper excited about that, and then, a little bit later, she was getting another ultrasound and the ultrasound tech said, how many kids do you think you’re having? How many babies do you think you’re having? And she said, two. And then she said, well, you may want to add a third on to that one.

She was indeed pregnant with triplets and had the babies successfully and everything turned out really well. I just saw the article online and I thought, you know, it’s really good for us to hear these kind of stories because this was a completely natural miraculous thing that happened. She didn’t undergo any kind of treatments. She’s actually don’t even notice it was possible. I just wanted to give hope to other parents out there that maybe struggling with something that miracles do happen and I don’t know, for my own personal experience, I went through some infertility as well and it’s really scary, you know, and you just don’t know what’s going to happen, anyone else on today’s call? Did anyone else go through any kind of infertility?

JULES MASS: I did.

SUNNY GAULT: Yeah, it’s scary, it’s scary.

JULES MASS: Well, for us, it was really long and we were actually at the end of our journey which was 10 years long.

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: Wow, that is a long journey.

JULES MASS: Well, again, why I call my blog Massive Miracle because we had tried several rounds of IVF and didn’t have enough eggs or this or that. Anyway, it’s a long story but basically, we put in our last two frozen eggs and didn’t expect that will work. No, we put in two eggs. [Inaudible] going, oh it’s one, oh it’s two, oh, it’s one, and barely, yeah, you have three, so we were yeah, and everybody is fine, so I mean, it does the chances of everything that we’ve ended up with. We’re just…

SUNNY GAULT: Yeah.

JULES MASS: I can completely identify…

SUNNY GAULT: Yeah.

GARETH MASSEY: We have so many friends that’ve had troubles and then they had finally decided to adopt or go with another rout and then, at the very end of it, just by chance happen, they get pregnant when they’re not expecting it.

SUNNY GAULT: Yeah, it’s an awesome story. I'll make sure I post it to our Facebook page for Twin Talks if you guys want to check it out, you can learn a little bit more about the mom and she’s got some great pictures of her and her triplets now, so again, just a great story, a nice heartwarming story.

[Theme Music]

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: Well, we’re here today with Jen Varela, a Gentle Sleep Expert from Sugar Night Night. Today, we’re talking about sleep training methods for twins. Okay, so Jen, we hear about sleep training all the time. Is it a new phenomenon or hasn’t been around and why is it all the rage?

JEN VALERA: It’s definitely been around, it’s not new. I do agree with you that it does seem to be such a hot topic at this point especially and I'm going to say in America, so I think it’s almost a better question to say is this really, why is this all the rage in America versus why is this all the rage right now because I think in other cultures, and I'm not sure if it’s such a hot topic as it is for ours. In my opinion, I think some of it has to do with the fact that we don’t live in villages anymore. The nuclear family is changed so much that we just don’t have the same kind of support available. I work with families all the time that they’re the only … You know, they don’t have any family in their city or even within driving this, and so, you know, we can’t get really daunting especially we have twins, right? And our culture we move it a really fast phase and we have things pretty scheduled. I think we kind of want the babies to fit into that schedule of it, and so, I think some of that place apart. Then especially here in our culture, as women you know, we go back pretty early to work compared to like some of the European countries as far as how long maternity leave is. I think all of those factors play a big part in why sleep training has become so important because of how our culture is and how our lifestyles are.

GARETH MASSEY: I think it starts so young you know, as once you bring the baby home, you’re staring the sleep training and you’re creating routine and you’re creating good habits and bad habits, it’s being consistent with swaddling, with breastfeeding, with having a night time routine not keeping the babies stimulated when it is suppose to be sleep time, and going through that processes as they start to change and be bigger and moving around you know, still being consistent with the process no matter what your process is. For us it is, maybe we would give the baby a bathe then we would read a books, sing a song and then it’s night, night time, and that was the same routine for the twins and so what’s for our single. There were times where you were having to do like a 99.11 kind of thing. You’re watching this, you know, you go in, you say, it’s night, night time and then you lay them back down or you sing a song one more time and then, you give them a minute and then you go out, and then it’s hard because they’re crying for you and then you go back in, sleep night, night time, go back after minutes. You start increasing the time between and that seem to work really well for us, but it is hard when there’s just like crying for you and you’re like oh men, you know, put they are full, their diapers are changed and everything is good. If you’re being consistent from day one with their sleep process then, it’ll be easier when they get bigger.

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: Absolutely.

JULES MASS: I would agree with that. My family, we did a mixture of many different things, taking the baby’s needs as our bases for starting any sort of thing that we tried but we didn’t have things that we wanted to do that matched with Gareth was just saying, we wanted to have that story bed time, and we work that into our plan but we specifically eventually started to use 90 minute sleep program which I had a book by Polleymore that helped us a great deal because one of the reasons we eventually started doing an active sleep training was because again, going back to bed an hour and a half rolling schedule of just feeding them on demand and making sure they were taking care. We were finding ourselves in a situation where it was taking us two hours to put a baby down at night. Why is this taking so long? And I happen to have this book and I read it. It was talking about how … There is just 80 minute and 90 minute sleep cycle. If you try to put the baby down after he have missed their sleepy zone then they’re going to be awake again for another 90 minutes. We’re like, oh my god, that’s exactly what’s happening. The great thing about that book is that it talked about nap schedules and how to look for the signals in your children about when they’re tired and how to work that into their days so that you can be flexible with what your child needs and that’s really hard when you have three at the same time but it made us able to come up with a way to have a daily schedule that allowed for having naps and we were really strict about you know, we have to do naps. It’s inconvenient for us but it’s what our children need, and so, eventually, down the line after about, I want to say when they were eight months old, we finally had them all on the same schedule but it took a long time to get them adjusted to that.

GARETH MASSEY: Yeah, and absolutely so important. I think one thing that I always advice my friends on is whatever your processes, make it something that you can do anywhere, not that oh, you have to be in a certain spot of the house at the certain time, at the certain angle, you know, you have a certain blanket or certain song or something that you can bring with you anywhere then you’re not going to be tied to oh, shoot, you know, I have to be home in 30 minutes or else Jimmy is not going to go to sleep and then I'm going to be pulling my hair out, so that’s important to make sure you can do it anywhere and when you’re planning to not make it so it’s just at one certain location.

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: Yeah, there is the idea of being consistent and having structure and then having flexibility as well. Now, I want to turn this back over to Jen and your thoughts, and also, can you tell us a little bit about some of the different terms. I'm hearing sleep training, sleep coaching, and night weaning. Can you kind of explain what the difference of those? What it really means?

JEN VALERA: Sleep training is basically when you use a certain regiment to adjust your child sleep behavior. Sleep training often really brings about the thought that it’s all about tears and it’s only tears and I think it comes of kind of awaited feel about it. Sleep coaching is a new more of a term I guess and it doesn’t quite hold the same emotional currency and it can be what you’re doing over more of the long period of time having to do sleep hygiene and then teaching your child, how to fall asleep on their own and self-regulate. Sleep is a learned skill and definitely temperament plays a lot into that. We can talk about that but when you look at some of the strategies on how you would go about teaching your child to self-suit night weaning comes up a lot too in that same context. Night weaning isn’t necessarily required in order to have your child learn how to self suit. So night weaning is often associated with sleep training but in my opinion it doesn’t have to be that you have to night wean in order to sleep train. There are some little ones that you maybe do need to get down to one feed versus multiple feeds so that they can get a consistent answer from you and that’s not so much in the met reinforcement but with regards to sleep training, night weaning isn’t necessarily a must in that. Does that kind of help clarify a little bit?

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: And so sounds like this is kind of just one component of hey, what’s working best for your family and then the needs of the family. Now, specifically talking to the families of twins which is a specialty in of itself as we all know. It’s a little bit different than singletons. What are some of those common needs that you see which don’t necessarily apply to singletons?

JEN VALERA: I think, one really big one is that when you have twins, you really just don’t have the luxury of letting your baby sleep until they wake to eat, right? I think the reality is that if you got more than one and you don’t get them on the same feeding schedule, it is a little bit precarious when you will get any sleep. For a singleton, it’s a little bit more of a luxury that I don’t think as parents of twins that you guys get to have. I also find it so interesting that there’s a gazillion different books out there, right? On how to help your babies be able to self-suit. Probably the one thing they all agree about is that with regards to multiples, you might have to compromise their theory, so I think that…

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: Oh, that’s funny.

JEN VALERA: Right, they’ve realized, oh, maybe my book doesn’t work exactly perfect for twins or multiples. Dr. Pollinmore even said, it’s okay to break the glass, an emergency box to manipulate the sleep schedule, so I think that’s funny, right? There’s real life and then there’s what the book says. I think the last one is the reality, you really of how they do need night time help whether that each parent takes the baby or you know, divide up the night in shifts or maybe you could get some outside help and I think you know, with singletons, with the two parent family, having the other parent be involved with it, the dad, with singletons might seem like a luxury but honestly, it’s all hands on deck when you’ve got multiples.

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: You know, I have to say that’s really interesting that you can talk about understanding the principles and then when it sounds like when you plays out, sometimes, you have to apply it slightly differently to your twins because they each having the things they’ll needs and I think that’s really important element that we as parents, you know, have to remember that they are individuals. They’re not just a unit. I'm sure our twin experts would agree with that. We’re going to take a break and when we come back, we’re going to talk about some of these comments training methods that we’ve been discussed.

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CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: Well, welcome back. Today, we’re talking with Jen Varela of Sugar Night Night about some common, sleep training methods. You know, Jen, there are a ton of books out there about sleep training but I think from what we’re hearing, it really boils down to about three specific types of sleep training methods. Can you tell us about how that shakes out?

JEN VALERA: Yes, sure, be my pleasure. I think you always have to ask yourself the first question which is what is the baby asking for? Is the baby asking to be held, rocked, nursed in your arms to sleep? And so, when you ask that little one to do some of the work so that you’re not doing all the work for them, that is when you’re starting to modify your answer to them, right? And asking them to not have you do all the work for them? When you think about sleep training or sleep coaching, you’re really looking at what is the answer that you’re going to give to your little one in order for them to learn how to self-regulate, and so, let’s just take that piece of it. There are really three methods but there are a lot of different names.

The first one is, “cry it out”. Basically, the answer to that question is kiss, cuddle, I love you. You’re going into the crib and I will return in the morning and you’re going to work this out in here. It’s the method that allows the baby to cry for specific period of time before the parents were offer comfort. It’s probably the most strict method of all the methods, and with that comes a lot of different opinions, there is a lot of science behind it and it is something that when parents are looking at what’s the fastest method, if you’re going to pick the fastest method, that would be it. However, it does not work for all temperaments of children and I don’t think there’s anything out there that can really give you an accurate answer to how long is okay to let your baby cry. That really also can be very much depended on child to child also. That’s first method.

The second method is “graduated extinction or controlled crying or Ferber or time checks”. The answer to the question is just cuddle I love you. You go into the crib. I'm going to leave for a period of time and then I will come back, so usually start with small increments of time, three to five minutes, then you come in, kiss cuddle I love you. You typically don’t pick up. You don’t stay for much longer than two minutes and then you leave and then you keep coming back in at increments that are a little longer and a little longer and a little longer. And so, the answer to the question is mom and dad always come back but you do need to work this out in here.

The third method of sleep training has a gazillion names, “pick up, put down, shirts down, pet down, kinder, shuffle”, and it’s basically fading, and fading is when you stay with the child, asking them to do a little more and a little more the work as you are staying with them. And so, that’s basically overall, the three methods. Now, there are different things that you can do to support those three methods which have to do with routines and environment and wake windows and all of that, but as far as the actual behavioral piece, there’s really three methods.

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: So just going to our parents here, which of these seemed to work for you?

JULES MASS: We did the fading, the graduated Ferber method where we would put them down for five minutes, let them cry and then come back and then put them down and then for seven minutes, we gradually build up until they learn how to do it themselves and it was tough because we had two kids in room and one in by herself. It was tough on my too because of the hormones. I had a really hard time seeing them cry. I had to go outside and my husband was with me when we did this, so he would go in and take care of them if they really needed it because my instinct was to just to go in there because it end, so it was really hard on me but I don’t know if it was as hard on them.

CHRISTEL: We did the graduated extension as well like go in for two minutes, out for two minutes and four and then, you know, increasing from there but before, I was confident enough to do of that. I had to make sure that all my other ducks were in a row like I had to know that they’ve been feeding well throughout the day and that they’ve been well rested on their naps and I kind of did a checklist of things before I took that approach.

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: So it sounds like you’re looking at it from the biological standpoint and I think incorporating what we talked about earlier, some of those different cycles on looking at their individual needs and you can kind of customize that because I think you know, kind of what Jen said earlier is that there’s a lot of different books out there that will talk about the new onesies of each of these but as a parent, I think you just have to find what works for you and their biology is going to be different and their temperaments are different and it’s not a one size fits all approach.

CHRISTEL: No, and it’s not easy like when you do something that involves any type of crying or letting your … They’re so tiny and they’re so young and I'm a first time parent. A lot of first time parents, we all you know, we don’t know what we are doing, and so we’re making an executive decision when we start doing sleep training. And for me, you know, I wanted to be confident in what I was doing. I didn’t want to feel teemed or uncertain because I know consistency was like key to all of this. The only way I could be consistent was to know that I had at least like an ounce of faith in what I was doing, so that’s why I really looked at all of the other elements before I went to the night training.

JEN VALERA: And I have to just to pledge you as a sleep coach listening to you talk, it is so fun to hear how you have really looked at the science and you’ve looked at your individual child and you’ve gone, okay, how can I meet this individual child needs that they you know, making in educated decision. And when I do a lot of workshops and I always talk about the biology of sleep first because if you can set them up for success physically by doing the right wake windows and making sure they’re getting enough sleep in the 24 hours and then, you also go okay. And what’s the answer to the question that I'm going to give them? And can I be consistent with that answer? Because it really almost doesn’t matter which methods you use if you can’t be consistent, you’re not going to see a shift.

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: I mean, are there any other sort of hard and fast rules that we should be thinking about when we’re choosing any of these methods?

JEN VALERA: If you don’t have a plan, then you’re going to be all over the place, and you’re not going to be able to follow the trail. And so, there are really two reasons why sleep training works. One is, pretty much every book says, baby needs to go and drowsy by the wake, and I always want to go, okay, and where is that land? Because by the time you put the baby in there, they’re probably just awake now, right? But the reality is they need to be aware of their environments so that when they go through a partial arousal, it is not a shocking thing, they know where they are. And then, whatever they used to get themselves to go to sleep, they’ll do again. So that’s really important. The other part is giving that consistent answer, and that is really based of a psychological term called an extinction burst and it basically means this, if you give your child the same answer to their same question, they will first go, oh, you changed to answer to this question. What’s going on? And then, they will resolve.

And so, when you think about that answer you’re going to give them, I think you have to really be honest about can you follow through with that answer? And so, some of the things that I think keep parents from being able to follow through is one, is you know, if you’re wondering if your baby is hungry, I mean, there’s nothing worst that in the middle of the night going, hmm, is my baby hungry and that’s why they’re crying? And so, I think it’s so important that you really get good information from your pediatrician on how long can I child go between feeds. How much my baby be eating during the day. If you’re breastfeeding I think getting good information from your lactation consultant on your supplying demand and what’s working for your child.

Before you even start anything you know, what your baby needs, you'll know you'll be able to follow through because you’re not going to question that in the middle of the night. I think kind of going through and then taking a look at well, can I really do the tears? And I think you can always ask yourself if you start at one phase and you need to go faster, well, there’s always an option to go faster, so I think you need to get really honest about what can you do and what can you follow through it. And then, I think temperament plays also a really huge piece in all of this. Temperament and personality are different, and so, temperament is biologically determined whereas personality is a product of the social environment. And so, your baby kind of comes in with the certain bent.

And little personalities, so they have three categories, they call it the difficult child, they easy child and the slowed warm up or shy child. I'm going to tell you, in my practice, it’s really true, the really sensitive children or really alert children are the ones that sleep is so hard. It’s so hard to get them to let go of that information that’s coming in and to be able to come and regulate. You really got to take a look at goodness of fit on what are your expectations and demand of your child and is that a good fit for your child’s development? Because I do find that there’s some little ones, if you power up on them, they will power up on you and before you know it, all of the sudden here in a world of like, woo, I'm not sure if this is a good place or not. And if you haven’t found the right sleep window in order to implement that answer, so let’s say, you missed that sleep window in quarters all kicks in and now, you’re implementing one of these methods, you might find it won’t work because you haven’t set them up for success with the right sleep windows. I think sensitive and effective parenting, it requires parents to adopt our personal expectations to making sure it’s a good fit for the child, so some children those really very structured methods are wonderful and work great, and some babies they need to be nudge. It’s too hard for them to go that hard and fast.

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: Well, now, this is really some great considerations. I mean, I wish that we as parents had sort of a checklist where we could do an assessment of our kids and their temperaments and understand that and then look at our own bents to see what can we tolerate as a parent and then of course times two, so I was going to say, thanks to Jen and our parents today. So now, be sure to visit our episode page on our website for more information about sleep training as well as links to additional resources. This conversation continues for members of our Twin Talks Club. After the show, we’ll talk about our parent’s favorite sleep accessories for kids. For more information about the Twin Talks Club, visit our website www.newmommymedia.com .

[Theme Music]

SUNNY GAULT: All right, so it’s time for fun segment we have on the show called “annoying twin comments”. It’s been a while since we’ve done this segment. If you’re new to Twin Talks, you may not heard of this segment before, but this is our way of venting of the crazy things that people say to us with our twins or triplets when we’re out in public and so, I ask for some of the most crazy stories that you guys have on Facebook and this is what Jolina had to say.

Jolina says at the grocery store with my two month old fraternal boys and a store clerk asked if they were twins, then proceeded to say, I'm 20 and lucky to not have a kid. I was bounded with having children is not for everyone. Next, the asked, are you still with the guy? I didn’t think I heard the question correctly and she repeated the question. Are you still with the guy? In shock, I calmly and quickly replied, yes then, walked away.

Oh, Jolina, that’s crazy. That’s crazy that people think that they can just ask whatever questions like suddenly because we have twins we’re not going to stay with our partners, really? It’s not bad that we can’t even stay with my partners. Okay, so crazy clerk story, of course. Thanks so much for sharing this. I'm still scratching my head going what in the world was that clerk thinking. If you guys have a crazy story of something someone said to you on public, tell us, we’ll commiserate with you and this hope like experience. You can go to our website at www.newmommymedia.com . Click the contact link and send us an email. You can post it to our Twin Talks Facebook page.

And also through the website, if you want to tell your story yourself, just click that grey button on the side that says send voice mail, and in that way, you can share it and we’ll just kind of take that little snippet of what you record and we’ll include it in the future episode.

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SUNNY GAULT:

CHRISTINE STEWART FITZGERALD: That’s wraps up our show for today. We appreciate you listening to Twin Talks.

Don’t forget to check out our sister show:
• Preggie Pals for expecting parents
• Boob Group for moms who breastfeed
• Parent Savers for parents with infants and toddlers and
• Newbies for newly postpartum moms
• This is Preggie Pals, your pregnancy you way.

[Disclaimer]
This has been a New Mommy Media production. The information and material contained in this episode are presented for educational purposes only. Statements and opinions expressed in this episode are not necessarily those of New Mommy Media and should not be considered facts. While such information and materials are believed to be accurate, it is not intended to replace or substitute for professional, medical advice or care and should not be used for diagnosing or treating health care problem or disease or prescribing any medications. If you have questions or concerns regarding your physical or mental health or the health of your baby, please seek assistance from a qualified health care provider.

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