The Boob Group
Elimination Diets: Food Sensitivities in the Breastfed Baby

[00:00:00]

Please be advised, this transcription was performed from a company independent of New Mommy Media, LLC. As such, translation was required which may alter the accuracy of the transcription.

SUNNY GAULT: Babies cry! That’s how they communicate with us. But some babies cry a lot more than others. And when that happens, we go back to the drawing board and try and figure out why? For breastfed babies, one possible answer could be food sensitivities given through the breastmilk. So how do you figure out which foods are causing the problem? Today, we’re talking about elimination diets for breastfeed mom. We’re The Boob Group.

[Theme Music/Intro]

SUNNY GAULT: Welcome to The Boob Group. We’re here to support all moms who want to give their baby’s breastmilk. I'm Sunny Gault. Thanks so much for listening to our show today. This is, get this, our 160th episode of The Boob Group which is amazing. We’ve covered lots of topics. I know, right, 160, but we’re always looking for more topics.

So, please, visit the episode the episode guide on our website at www.NewMommyMedia.com , look through those topics, tell us if there’s something we haven’t discussed that you want more information about. That’s a great way to get involved in our show. And another awesome way is to leave a review for our podcast on iTunes. It is a great way to have other moms discovered our show. It only takes a couple minutes and it’s really helpful for us.

And by the way, we’re not just on iTunes but we’re on a lot of different platform. So any platform where you can comment and leave a review again, that’s really helpful for us. So let’s go ahead and meet the mammas joining our conversation today. Why don’t you don't you guys tell us a little bit about yourself and your family and let us know if you’ve experience elimination diet, if you know that your children have had food sensitivities in the past. So Graeme, let’s start with you.

GRAEME: Hi, I'm Graeme and I have two kids. My son, Andrew is almost three. He probably had a food sensitivity. We just didn’t about it. My daughter Lorie is six months old and she definitely does. She has been diagnosed as an MSPI baby. So it’s Milk and Soy Protein Intolerance is technically what her thing is, which is lots of fun, good times.

SUNNY GAULT: All right, and Tracy, I know we’re going to learn a little bit more about you as an expert later on but tell us, you’re mom as well, so tell us a little bit about your family.

TRACY CASSELS: I am a mother too to two kids. My daughter Maddy is five, almost six, and still nursing. And she actually had a milk protein allergy which we discovered was an allergy later on but started as allergy milk protein intolerance. And my son is Theo. He is four months, almost five months. And he has a spectrum of foods that I am not eating, that seemed to be more sensitivity than any diagnosable intolerance and I know that something we’ll talk about a bit later too.

SUNNY GAULT: Yes, absolutely. All right, well, ladies, thanks so much for being with us. We’ll take a quick break and we’ll be right back.

[Theme Music]

SUNNY GAULT: All right, so before we kick off our conversation today, we’re going to talk about a news headline. As you know, I like to find headlines that relate to breastfeeding and pumping and talk about them, and talk about their meaning and what we think about them. So this one actually comes form, I believe this is in the UK. Did I get that right? I think it is. And it’s a mom that created the first ever for the UK, first ever breastfeeding café. Her name is Charlotte Purdie. She’s 22 which props to her at 22, and she’s starting her business. That’s amazing. I think I was just I don’t know what I was doing, something I shouldn’t been doing in college at 22.

Anyways, she has a one year old son and you know, she basically launched this breastfeeding café as a result of you know, just having some bad experiences with being able to breastfeed her baby in public. And so, that headline is, and I have to say right from the get-got, I think, this is a little bit misleading, but the headline is “young mom receives death threats after opening UK’s first breastfeeding café”.

Now, if you read a little bit further in the headline, it does mention that there has been some pushback and even some death threats. I don't think that’s the norm. I don’t think the whole community is open arms saying how dare you launch this café which by the way, it’s not just for breastfeeding moms and pumping moms. It’s for dads. It’s for anyone that is supportive of breastfeeding and it’s fine with moms being able to feed their babies, the way they want to feed their babies in public.

And so, anyways, that’s just kind of a little bit of the background but she has received apparently some death threats which seems crazy to me but apparently there’s some people that have a problem with this. So I wanted to talk about it a little bit today and see what you guys think. Graeme, let’s start with you. What are your thoughts on this?

GRAEME: Yeah, the headline of the article, is a little misleading because reading it does sound like you know, most of the people around her are really excited about it and have been really supportive. But the facts that even one person thought that it was cool to send in a death threat over feeding a baby is just kind of insane to me and I don’t use that word that often that that is literally insane. I just can’t understand that.

SUNNY GAULT: Well, that thing is, is that I know this is considered in public but it’s not like and I know people you know, struggle with moms just breastfeeding on a bench or something in a park or something that that’s really open. But this is even in a building that you would have to walk into in order to see it. So if you don’t want to see it, don’t walk into the building like I mean, to me it’s a little crazy too. Tracy, what do you think?

TRACY CASSELS: I mean, I agree. I think there’s hopefully a lot of good. And I think on sense, I'm just thrilled to see something like this even the fact that you mentions there is a breastfeeding peer counselor on hand to help families since they came in to have this walking spot, go grab a coffee, something to eat and someone to help you with breastfeeding is just brilliant idea, but the fact that one, I mean, and it sounds like even more than one like she mentions multiple in the middle of the night receiving death threats. Just speaks to how far we still have to go to kind of renormalize breastfeeding in kind of a western world here.

SUNNY GAULT: Yeah.

TRACY CASSELS: And it’s mind boggling that as you said, anyone could think that a place where you have to actively enter to see it is somehow a problem. I don’t understand that logic in any way she performed.

SUNNY GAULT: And now, it really doesn’t make sense and obviously, she’s put a lot of time and effort. She thought it was so important because of her own breastfeeding struggles in public. And again, this is in the UK but we, weeks, it doesn’t matter if you live in Canada, if you live in United States, we’re all kind of struggling with this. This is a topic of conversation really the world, the westernize world is really talking about now. And so, yeah, she obviously feels very passionate about it, and she’s trying to help moms. It’s called The Milk Lounge if you guys are wondering. But, we’ll go ahead. It’s in Nottingham. I just found that. It’s in Nottingham. So we’ll go ahead. We’ll post a link to it on our Facebook page if you guys want to check it out.

Maybe we can just raise some positive encouragement for this mama to say hey, you’re doing an awesome job, and then maybe overcome some of this for her. So we’ll post it to our page if you guys want to check it out.

[Theme Music]

SUNNY GAULT: Today, we’re talking about elimination diets for breastfeeding moms whose children may have food sensitivities. And Tracy Cassels, she’s Ph.D.in Developmental Psychology. She’s also the founder and writer for www.evolutionaryparenting.com which will be show to link too. She has written a great article on this topic we’ll link to that as well. And Tracy has two children with food sensitivity, so she knows all about this even from personal experience. So, Tracy, welcome to The Boob Group.

TRACY CASSELS: Thank you very much for having me.

SUNNY GAULT: So, when we talk about baby’s crying, the first thing I think many of us think about, I think it’s kind of overused a lot is the word colic. Oh we’ve got, this colicky baby. We don't know what to do with this colicky baby. But, how did you know personally that something was a little bit different with your kids and this wasn’t the typical colic?

TRACY CASSELS: Well, it started for me with knowing right of the bat that colic really is a five letter word for we don't know what’s wrong.

SUNNY GAULT: Right.

TRACY CASSELS: So, there’s many different things that it could be. I actually did it with my daughter who is the one with the milk protein allergy did not even think about food as a possible issue. It was our midwife who discovered it at day five. And because she has an allergy, she also had and associated rash that was we thought was rash. She took one look and knew right off the bat that it was not. So it was during our home visit on day five when our midwife came to see her. She said, there’s something wrong here, and recommended the first thing that I eliminate was dairy. So that was kind of my first experience with it and my husband wasn’t quite on birth. He was just it’s just colic and let’s leave but I don't want to change LR-diet and everything but I did and within a few days, we had a totally different baby.

So, it really highlighted to me the need to look more into this and discover what we know about this issue. And then, with my son, I don’t even know about dairy for him because I'm still not on it. But he was crying at a pitch that was unbelievably different. And I also knew that he didn’t have the associated rash. So anything he had would’ve been sensitivity but I also had my own health issues now that I knew might contribute to food sensitivity in him.

SUNNY GAULT: And Graeme, tell us a little bit about your story. How did you found out? You said you thought your son might have had it but then nothing was officially diagnosed, right?

GRAEME: Yeah, nothing was officially diagnosed with my son except, he did definitely have reflux. It’s two separate things but I think now that we are going through this with my daughter and we’re looking back on it, it probably was an reflux issue, and there was probably some food sensitivity in there as well, really, he was also intact and that helped tremendously. He was also on probiotics and that was like oh, my goodness, like she’s at, now, we had a different baby. This is amazing. With my daughter, that pitch of screaming, I think it’s instantly recognizable to anyone that’s been through it. This was not tiredness. This was not gas. This was not anything else. This was very specific thing. And when she started crying like that, and it was very early as well.

I went straight to the pediatrician and said this something is wrong. I don’t know what this is. And they tested her. I brought into up her diapers as well. They did test and my doctor came back and said, well, there’s good news and bad news. Good news is, there’s nothing terribly wrong. It’s not an allergy. It’s not you know, she’s healthy. Bad news is no more milk or soy for you. So, yeah, that’s when we found out that it was a milk soy protein intolerance. It’s not an allergy, hopefully not an allergy moving forward.

TRACY CASSELS: And I just want to add in quickly exactly what Graeme said, it’s that pitch of cry that I think some people don’t acknowledge, if you haven’t heard it, it is truly something unique that you hear and it sounds like your child is being tortured. And it’s a horrible sound. And so, I think some people kind of think, oh, something is wrong because my baby is just crying. This goes above and beyond the type of cry you would hear when your child is fuzzing or tired or you know, over stimulated. And I think it’s worth mentioning that, so that parents kind of realize we’re not talking about your garden-variety cry here.

SUNNY GAULT: So we have that high pitch cry that you guys were both talking about. I know the rash, is that a common one too? What other symptoms?

TRACY CASSELS: When it comes to an allergy or strong intolerance, you do often see other symptoms. Rash being probably the most prominent because as the poo leaves the body, it’s also for an allergy, it’s an irritant to the whole skin as well. So it spreads and it is different. You also don’t expect to see a diaper rash very early on. And this rash is our midwife put it a very angry rash that comes. It is different as well from the typical diaper rash. One of the other things people seemed to miss is that a period of general fuzziness where it increases comes later, comes around six weeks into your child’s life. These come when there’s an allergy and intolerance. This happens right off the bat.

So as Graeme mentioned, it was right from the start. It was early on. With my daughter as I said, it was day five. It was diagnosed by our midwife, or eventually mentioned by our midwife as a possibility. And this was, you know, we’ve been having five days of she came out screaming, blue murder, and it was horrible. You also tend to see big difference pretty quickly when you do make a change if it is that. So some people will attempt the elimination diet that we’ll talk about, and they don’t see dramatic changes. When you do change something, you really are seeing a different baby at different times which is really important to note.

SUNNY GAULT: Okay. Now, what are some of the food sensitivities? What are some of the main ones that we see popping up over and over again?

TRACY CASSELS: Well, when you look at the research, there’s actually one that crops up, and that is milk, when you’re talking about sensitivities. Children can have allergies to a variety of things but in terms of the idea of just being sensitive, cow’s milk is the only one that comes up as crossing all children whether or not they later develop and intolerance or allergy but early on, it is very difficult. It crosses the gut barrier. It gets into the breastmilk and it is very, very difficult for them to digest those proteins. So it causes a lot of pain, gas, and generalize destress in infants who have it. But the problem with that is that, so a lot of people believe that that’s the only type of sensitivity that you can have. The problem is that it ignores that our research is really wholly incomplete on the topic.

So, for example, when we look at things like we eat or even soy, there’re may be difference in terms of how that food is ingested by moms. So we don’t have research looking at the types of preservatives that we add to our foods and it’s worth building that because we do have research looking at mice where they’ve look at our two primary preservatives and the effect on their gut functioning and found that within a very short time, mice exposed to these preservatives develop the same symptoms of IBS that many adults have. So there’s reason typically that may cross and we don't know if it crosses the gut barrier. It may cross and it may affect our infants more, so homemade bread may have a very different reaction than store bought bread as an example.

The second thing that hasn’t been look into the research and is relevant to the topic is the idea of mom’s own gut health. So autoimmune reactions women with or any autoimmune disorder and this could range from something like Hashimoto's disease to chronic stress syndrome or chronic pain results and inflammation of the system which also results in problems with the gut, most notably higher permeability. And this is colloquially referred to as leaky gut. And there’s a lot of debate about the validity of that as a widespread diagnoses. But it has been studied well and imperially looking at the relationship between autoimmune function and gut function. And these results in basically larger permeability in the gut, and items crossing the gap barrier into our blood stream that shouldn’t.

So our gut serves as the function to block the food from our bloodstream. And when that fails, items, particles, proteins get into our bloodstream and then get into our breastmilk and get to our babies. So their gut is having to digest things that it simply shouldn’t have to, yet. And so, some women may experience food sensitivities in a broader array of sensitivities because their own system isn’t working optimally.

SUNNY GAULT: How our children tested for these sensitivities? Like how, you know, if you brought your child into see the pediatrician, you know, what would they do to determine what the problem is?

TRACY CASSELS: With sensitivity alone, just a sensitivity, there isn’t a test. What you can’t have test is as Graeme had and in tolerance by bringing in fecal matter or an allergy which is also they’ll start with just a fecal matter to see if there’s a problem. Later on, you do allergy tests. It’s the same as older children. And so, they often don’t recommend it very early on because they are not very fun to experience. They are kind of painful for kids too, all the freaking and especially because they often do an array of them at once so you’re not just looking at you know, one then they’ll freak. There’s often a minimum of kind of five or six to look at different items that might be cross related to the first allergen.

SUNNY GAULT: Let’s talk a little bit about how these food sensitivities and all of your kids. You know, how this impacted your overall breastfeeding and if you’re pumping your pumping experience. So Graeme, let’s go back to you. How did this impact you? Set aside the elimination diet which we’ll talk about in a second. How did this impact your relationship for breastfeeding?

GRAEME: Well, it may be questioned honestly when I was talking to my pediatrician and she said, you’re going to have to cut out all dairy and you’re going to need to cut out all soy. In the beginning, I was like, well, okay. I don't know that I can do that. It was just a lot coming at me because it came out of the blue but knew that it also could not handle that level of screaming and especially once we knew that it was actively hurting her. There was a lot of guilt that just crashed into me out of nowhere because this thing that I was supposed to be feeding my baby and nourishing my baby and helping my baby, I know this isn’t true but my first thought was I have been poisoning her. I have been giving her these things that had been hurting her. And of course, I wasn’t doing in our purpose. And of course, you know, I know all of these things now but that was my, my first thing was I don’t know that I can do this.

My second thing is just guilt, guilt, guilt. And then, so I have a wonderful pediatrician and she said, well, you know, if you want to talk about different formulas that might help you supplements. If you need to just walk you through, you know, if you just keep pumping more just to more that you can flash yourself out just you know, get as much milk out of you to try and flash all of these things out, what do you need? And she asked me, what do you need that’s going to help you? Which was wonderful. That was a great thing to hear. And she gave me all kinds of just information. She had lots of print outs and things on how to work the whole diet thing. And I went home and Adam and I just sat down and talked about it. And I would love to say that we made this decision because I was so dedicated to breastfeeding but the truth is that we made this decision because the formulas that we would’ve been able to use for Lorie were extremely expensive.

It came down to a final decision for us. Now, once I knew that decision, now our breastfeeding relationship is so wonderful that I'm really glad that I did it. But, that is not why we made that decision initially and I just feel like, we should be honest about the reasons that we do all of these things, you know. Sometimes, it does come down to money. For me, it was really expensive and especially this is very specialized formula. She would’ve needed something. It had no soy and not milk in it.

SUNNY GAULT: Right, absolutely. And Tracy what about you? How did this impact your breastfeeding relationship with your children?

TRACY CASSELS: With my daughter, they’re really … I have to admit. There wasn’t. It wasn’t an issue of thinking … Formula never crossed my mind. Thanks to … I think my own upbringing me, my brother and sister all nursed until we self-wind around between three and four. So my memories in upbringing were just breastfeeding with the normal thing to do and that’s what I was going to do. So it was just okay, now, I cut it out and that’s what I’ll do. And that was, it cut out. She changed. I was happy and no dairy. With my son, it’s been a bit more different because it such a large ray of foods that I’ve had to cut out. And I did experience for the first time that guilt that Graeme was talking about that I’ve done something when I you know, made a mistake and you know, that we learned a new food that I couldn’t eat.

I was up with him as he was screaming for three hours in the middle of the night and I just remember thinking I'm horrible mother. I am a horrible, horrible person who have done this to this beautiful perfect little child, and so that’s been harder but overall, I still, you know, I’ve never considered supplementing or switching over with him. It’s just been working through it. And it is again a bit more different because it’s stands for my own health issues and so, actually, I get reactions too to things that many of these things that I have to cut out for him, so it’s a good reminder for me to monitor my own issues but outside of being frustrated by not being able to eat all that I’d like or you know, only being able to eat one type of bread that takes me two days to make is you know, it’s an inconvenience but it’s well worth-it.

SUNNY GAULT: All right, well, not, no, we’re going to take a quick break. When we come back, we’re going to explain more about what it takes to do in elimination diet. What’s all involved and how do you make it happen? So we’ll be right back.

[Theme Music]

SUNNY GAULT: Welcome back. We’re continuing our discussion about food sensitivities and elimination diets and Tracy Cassels is our expert. So Tracy, what is an elimination diet? We talk about this and what’s the goal of this diet?

TRACY CASSELS: The goal of the diet is an essence to discover often what types of foods might be causing problems for a breastfeed infant. So you’re basically removing various foods. In some cases, you know what it is and you’re simply removing the foods to avoid these very negative reactions that you’ve heard from both Graeme and myself, so you may know what it is based on a test like Graeme knows, it’s soy and dairy. In some cases like the case of my son, you’re basically eliminating various foods that you see have reactions or do not have to know what you can add back in and what you need to keep removed for either a partial term of your breastfeeding relationship or the full term of your breastfeeding relationship.

SUNNY GAULT: And this isn’t something that we have to do indefinitely. I mean, is it a temporary task or how does that work?

TRACY CASSELS: It depends on what you discover, so in the case of a child, like my daughter with the milk protein allergy. I'm now almost six years without dairy because she’s still nursing, and after a while, I just couldn’t eat it anymore either. So that was kind of a side effect of that. But in many cases, if you’re not sure what’s causing the problems, it’s not supposed to be a permanent change. You’re not eliminating 20 different types of foods, never to add them back in and that’s really important for people to know because I think they feel daunted. If they’re entering something and they don’t know exactly what’s causing the problem then it can seem very overwhelming to cut a whole bunch of stuff out especially if you think you’re never adding it back in again.

So it is not supposed to be, it is a diagnostic type tool. It’s not supposed to be permanent. If you do discover your child has an intolerance and allergy, so something beyond the sensitivity, you’re probably cutting it out for a longer period of time. And even with the sensitivity, you can be adding it back in as your child got matures and they get older.

SUNNY GAULT: Graeme, were you concerned in going into this that you may have to eliminate more than what was diagnose or what were your thoughts in going through and knowing that you’re going to have to cut some stuff out of your diet?

GRAEME: Okay, well, let me just be honest. You want ice cream like seriously.

SUNNY GAULT: I know, that’s what I first thought off too.

GRAEME: If you get the right brand, my whole family switched over to coconut milk, even the people that don’t need too, yeah, for the ice cream. I mean, I have, I am proud. I’ve tried all of the things and nothing has been able to replace my love affair with Ben and Jerry except that Ben and Jerry because they miss me and the millions of dollars that I'm spending every year, they have announced a line of almond milk ice creams that I'm so excited about and I'm really like I'm about to walk to Vermont. I'm not [inaudible 00:25:02] right now.

That’s a lot there and get it, but, we did end up having to, I am now off of all dairy. Soy is just in everything like I don’t think we really understand. It’s in the vitamins that I take, like it’s in everything. And so I am not as militant about trying to stay away from the soy as I once was and she seems to be handling it just fine, but we’ve realized that leafy greens had been a problem once I knew what the difference was. From cutting things out, I was able to recognize some other foods. So I am now off a bowl of the leafy greens like spinach, kale, coloreds, all of it, things like that, and broccoli and cabbage had to go as well which is just very sad for me. Basically it’s anything that was my favorite food, but in return I have the happiest, chubbiest, oh my gosh best baby ever.

So, it has totally been wroth-it and it is like Tracy said, it’s a night and day kind of a change and you'll notice it pretty quickly. For us, it’s about two days. It’s about a day and a half to two days later. I guess that’s how my system just works where things have just made a huge difference and I’ve started taking probiotics and that’s helped her tremendously as well.

SUNNY GAULT: Okay, so Tracy, let’s walk through this because I know in your blog post that you have four different steps which I thought, I like breaking things down simply and like that. So let’s kind of go through these different steps. You say at first, identify all possible offending foods.

TRACY CASSELS: And this is the hard part because as Graeme even noted, you suddenly discover things down the line. So I too, I’ve had to cut out all crisp for us vegetables and it sucks because I love onions. I love them all. They’re all gone. I can’t do soy. I can’t do rice. So there are a lot of things that sometimes crop up that you really wouldn’t expect but you can kind of cast the wider net. If you start paying attention first to the reactions that you’re getting through your diet. You’re kind of see what to cut out but basically going to a very simple diet for a couple of weeks focusing on protein of a sort. If you fear soy, stay away from tofu and everything.

But, going down to the barebones diet of vegetables fruits you know, probably want to cut a bread, a lot of people do just because especially if it’s store bought about the potential issue of preservatives, some nuts, some seed, some protein, keep it simple. Typically, if you see a difference in your baby in two weeks, and as we said, this is one of the things, is that you tend to notice a pretty dramatic change in your child pretty quickly. So if you see that, you know you’ve cut something else that is causing a problem. So that’s kind of a first step, it’s figure out what they are and then you have to … And then, second step is eliminate for a couple weeks.

If you don’t see a difference after two weeks or it’s very minimal, chances are this isn’t the problem. You either have missed the food and it’s something weird or you really don’t have a child with the food sensitivity and most babies don’t have them. So we are talking about the monitory of babies here. So it can get over height and a lot of people end up on these diets that really shouldn’t, but for those that are suffering, these kinds of diets can be a lifesaver. So after two weeks, presumably, if you’ve seen a change and you now have what both myself and Graeme experience, this happy wonderful babies that are just suddenly loving life. And then your last step, you evaluate, is this change, am I comfortable where I am?

Do I want to just keep everything out and not risk it? Am I comfortable with this diet? Do I want to start adding things in, make your decision as to what it is your comfortable with going forward. And then, it’s to start reintroducing food, especially if you’ve got more than one you think. If you started with just a couple like say you’ll only cut out milk and soy which only as you know, I know because I’ve cut them both out. They’re in everything. So it’s not really adjust it is you, at least know. You’ve narrowed it down here to a pretty small food groups despite them being horrible ones they have to deal with because they are everywhere.

But if you cut out a ton, you start reintroducing one at a time. And because you know that high pitch horrible cry, you know when you reintroduce something exactly the change you’re going to experience. And so you have to be prepared for that because it may be that you reintroduce something by accident. I accidentally eat Bok Choy with my son, not thinking about it and had the worst night of just felt like a horrible, horrible, horrible, horrible person for having done it. So you have to be prepared to face that kind of accidental or intentional reintroduction, and then removal stage again. But if you go through one by one adding these foods back in, you can see what … Your child can now tolerate and know which foods to leave out which foods you can now add back into your diet safely.

SUNNY GAULT: Now, when you introduce or reintroduce a food, will you notice right away, like is it the difference, like we’re talking about earlier, hey, when you take something out, you'll notice it right away? Is it reintroducing it? Does it happen like that as well?

TRACY CASSELS: It’s yeah, and I mean, and let me say it right away, you’re usually talking within a both two days because everyone’s digestive system is different. So the ray that which you goes through yours and is absorbed and then transferred, it can be for some people with the faster absorption. They’ll notice that they’ll have it at breakfast. They’ll experience a problem that night. For some people, it may be the next day. So, it’s within that timeframe but yes, you should know there’s a difference right away. But I often say the people, you know, depending on dosage, you may still want to give it a week or so for each new introduction because sometimes, it can build up. It’s more that you notice that a child could handle a small amount of something but not a lot.

Like exactly what Graeme knows with small bits of soy. She’s able to take it in the vitamins and this and that, but if she were to go out and order a tofu stake, she’d probably have …

GRAEME: Yeah, nowhere. No fun [inaudible 00:31:08] restaurants for me. No Tie Food, none of that. What I have found is that I can, every once in a while, I can go to Starbucks and have a very small soy something as a treat that I can do but I cannot go to the Tie place that I used to go to all the time that has like tofu and soy sauce and you know, I can’t do that. So there are the levels of what she can take and I know that if I have done one thing, and had a little bit of something with soy in it, and that’s it for like a week or more.

TRACY CASSELS: Exactly, and that’s the kind of difference the people looking for. You start to see these kinds of changes pretty quickly and what … So you start learning. It’s a whole learning process of what are the levels that can be tolerated and what isn’t. And in some case is when its only sensitivity is people actually end up reintroducing everything and their baby is fine because the time it takes to reintroduce everything if they’ve cut a lot out. And it’s just the sensitivity, not intolerance and an allergy. Then their baby’s gut has actually developed enough to be able to process everything. So that I think some [inaudible 00:32:16] they see a big difference and they see a very dramatically but as they reintroduce things, suddenly, they’re not seeing these difference anymore, and it’s usually the time it takes if they do it six weeks and suddenly their baby is now four and a half five months.

Well, that’s actually a huge developmental stage for the intestines in the gut of little baby. So their child has actually develop the types of probiotics, the types of Gut flora that’s needed to digest these various items that are now being reintroduced.

SUNNY GAULT: Is there ever a point where an elimination diet should be monitored not just by mom but by like a health care professionals or anyone that should really you know, seek some additional help with this or is this all pretty much, something that you know, you can kind of do on your own.

TRACY CASSELS: I think if you have any medical condition yourself, you should be talking to someone overseeing it. If you have any fear of the medical state of your child, you should be overseeing it. I also think people need to be careful not to cut so much out that they put themselves at risk. You’re not looking to endanger your wellbeing or your health. So I think at any time, it’s actually great idea to be going whether it’s your midwife as we did with ours, if it’s a pediatrician who you trust and have a good relationship with. I know sometimes it’s hard to get in to pediatrician, so it’s not something that’s easy and accessible for anyone, even just a nutritionist is a good person to follow up with.

So if you are considering it, I think especially if you’re going to identify and eliminate a wide variety of foods. You want to make sure that your keeping your health up, that you’re able to get all the nutrients you need and so, speaking with someone about that is incredibly important. If you’re just cutting out one potential thing, I think it’s less so. If you’re just looking at I think my baby reacts to even dairy, you know, people go vegan all the time. You know, you may want to look up. I always recommend looking up issues with that but if you’re cutting out dairy for two weeks, you’re likely not going to run into any life threatening problems along the way.

And so, it really depends on what you’re looking to do the length of time and how much you’re actually taking out. But I think in any case that go to is really probably to keep in touch and talk to someone about it.

SUNNY GAULT: All right ladies. Well, thanks so much for all the information that you’ve given today. And I think we’ve govern our listeners a lot to think about and to consider if they’re thinking about an elimination diet. So I appreciate you guys being part of our show today.

If you’re member of The Boob Group Club, then please be sure to check out our bonus content for this episode. We know elimination diets may seem challenging but switching to formula as Graeme mentioned earlier may not necessarily be the answer and we’ll talk a little bit more about why. For more information about our club, visit our website at www.NewMommyMedia.com .

[Theme Music]

SUNNY GAULT: All right, so before we wrap up our episode, we have a question from one of our listeners and this comes from Michelle Lee. She posted this on our Facebook page. And so, Michelle Lee write, she says, I need some help ladies. My preemie 34 weeks, she’s in the NICU. She’s two weeks old today. The doctor was just telling me Friday, he wants to Similac, Human Milk Fortifier, first ingredients, non-fat milk, whey protein, corn syrup solids, I will not to mention, also contained soy. I said absolutely not, obviously this turned into a discussion but I was armed with knowledge and dangerous, increase risk of NEC, not to mention, the reason we chose to breastfeed is to avoid having all this in our system.

Now, he says, it’s not just because of the protein and fat content that he needs to use it but because she’s a preemie and add an increased risk of developing rickets. I researched and I he agree to try Prolacta's human milk fortifier which is made from breastmilk, but it may not be covered by our insurance and this is quite literally the only option. If it’s not covered, I'll have to pay out of pocket and it may not in our budget. He’s adamant about her requiring a fortifier. Obviously rickets is a Vitamin D deficiency but other things like calcium, phosphorous, magnesium come into play. I suggested a multivitamin and mineral supplement if Prolacta’s human milk fortifier isn’t covered but he isn’t for that. I'm ready to seek a second opinion but at this point, my options are only limited.

But he’s also saying that we’ll transfer her to children for a second option because my insurance will cover it. Seriously, she’s really upset, so now, her significant others upset because they feels like she’s putting the baby a risk for rickets when she’s only trying to decrease her risk for other things. So, bottom line, she wants to know how does she get both of them on board that she does not want to use a milk fortifier.

HELEN ANDERSON: Hi Michelle, my name is Helen Anderson. I'm one of the experts here at New Mommy Media. I'm a registered nurse and a certified lactation educator and I want to thank you for sharing your story. Sounds like your baby and you and your significant other in a tough situation and my heart really goes out to you. So I want to share a little bit of advice with you. This is advice is really for anyone that has a baby or anybody that they care about in the hospital as an inpatient. And this comes from experience as a registered nurse and also a patient advocate. If you have concerns about your baby’s treatment plan, you can get a second opinion from another doctor that’s in the hospital.

Your baby doesn’t need to be transferred out unless you’re at such a small hospital that you don’t have any other physicians on staff. You can also request that your baby have a nutritional consult and that’s where a nutritionist will come in, probably look at your baby’s lab results, look at the medical history, do a physical exam on your advent and make recommendations on treatment based on their expertise and nutritional therapy. And hopefully you’re at the hospital with the deep talent pool so that you have a nutritionist that does have a background in the special need to premature infants.

You know, that during the last trimester, our baby’s absorb a lot of their calcium and phosphorus from our bones then they have those nutrients in their body and ready to go when they’re born, but since your baby was born a bit early, he or she may not have had enough those nutrients transferred to guard against rickets and it sounds like you’re pretty well aware of the risks of supplementing with formula but also the risk of rickets and soft bones. So, my recommendation is for you to sit down with some other providers at your hospitals, some other experts and kind of get around table discussion going. So it’s not just you and the doctor discussing but we have some other voices coming into. So I want to thank you again for your question and wish the best of luck and your baby’s lucky to have you for a mom.

[Theme Music]

SUNNY GAULT: All right, that wraps up our show for today. Thanks so much for listening to The Boob Group.

Don’t forget to check out our sister show:
• Preggie Pals for expecting parents
• Newbies for newly postpartum moms
• Parent Savers for parents with infants and toddlers and
• Twin Talks for parents with multiples.

This is Preggie Pals, your pregnancy you way.

[Disclaimer]
This has been a New Mommy Media production. The information and material contained in this episode are presented for educational purposes only. Statements and opinions expressed in this episode are not necessarily those of New Mommy Media and should not be considered facts. While such information and materials are believed to be accurate, it is not intended to replace or substitute for professional, medical advice or care and should not be used for diagnosing or treating health care problem or disease or prescribing any medications. If you have questions or concerns regarding your physical or mental health or the health of your baby, please seek assistance from a qualified health care provider.

SUNNY GAULT: New Mommy Media is expanding our line-up of shows for new and expecting parents. If you have an idea for a new series, or if you’re a business, or organization interested in joining our network of shows through a co-branded podcast, visit www.NewMommyMedia.com.
[00:40:14]
[End of Audio]