Kaile Hunt 0:07
You've heard the phrase, it takes a village to raise a baby. But how true is it? Whether you are in the newborn stage, the infant stage, or just entering toddlerhood, we are diving deep into finding that village in ways you can keep your peace and protect your mental health, with or without your village, thanks for joining us. This is newbies.

Welcome to newbies. My name is Kaile Hunt, and I'll be your host today, if you haven't already, be sure to visit our website at New mommy media.com and subscribe to our weekly newsletter, which keeps you updated on all the episodes we release each week. Another great way to stay updated is to hit that subscribe button in our podcast app. And if you're looking for a way to get even more involved with our show, then check out our online community. It's called Mighty moms. That's where we chat more about the topics discussed here on our show, and it's also an easy way to learn about our recordings, so you can join us live. Our expert today is Dr Amber J landers, PhD, who is a licensed clinical psychologist with experience in consultation and brief interventions in primary care, school and early childhood settings. She completed her BA at UC Riverside. Her doctorate at Purdue University and postdoctoral training at Harvard Medical School, Cambridge Health Alliance. Her interests lie in training and integrating mental health into non mental health settings, reducing stigma and promoting health and mental health for underserved population, children and families. She is currently program director at and assistant professor in the Psy D program at California School of Professional Psychology, CSPP at Alliant International University San Francisco campus. She is the mother of a four year old boy and a one and a half year old girl who Dr Amber, I just gave a huge bio for you. But please thank you for being here and tell us more about your family.

Dr. Amber Landers 2:41
Thank you for having me. Yes. So I have a one and a half year old girl named Lily and a four year old boy named Levi, and they are right now at that age where she is chasing him around and he is deciding whether he likes that or not. I also have a husband, and he's a great support, and we are figuring out this thing together. I love that. Well, we are so happy to have you here, and we also have a mama here with us today. Destani please tell us more about your family.

Destani Lena Gerbrandt
Hi, thanks for having me. Yes, we have a newly three month old, like three months like, two days ago, and his name is Dean, sweet baby boy. We're definitely in those newborn trenches. Things are looking at, but having a support system and an awesome husband is making it fly by.

Kaile Hunt 3:28
Definitely. I remember when I was in the newborn stage, it just, it really does fly by, like it seems like a blur, and yet you definitely feel every single day and night. So it'll be excited to talk about that and how our village can help. I will also be chiming in on my experience with finding a village within the first year, especially being a military wife and an ocean away from all of my college friends and family who have kids similar in age, as well as what helps my mental health, especially during the newborn days.

Today, we're discussing finding that village and ways having a village can help your maternal mental health. Dr landers, first portion is for you. So let's chat about maternal mental health and how important it is to be on the lookout for postpartum depression and anxiety. And this is kind of a two part question. So let's talk about right after birth, right the hours, the days, even, because some women, you know, stay in the hospital for two to three days, and then compare that to maybe two or three weeks when you're really in the fourth trimester. Yeah, well, really, I was going to say that it's important to look for it right after birth, and even within the first two years after birth. So right after birth, a lot is going on, like when the baby's first born, where you know symptoms can a true depression anxiety can kind of go unnoticed, because being stressed is normal, being tired is normal. Some mood changes are to be expected, and the most common thing that folks experience is what we call baby blues, which is kind of like a lower level depression. People might feel kind of teary eyed for no reason.

Dr. Amber Landers 5:00
Might feel sad, they might feel a little guilty about being sad because we're told that we're supposed to be so happy, but we're tired and we're sad and we're like, what is going on? And that's pretty common experience for folks to have right after birth and a couple of days and even a couple of weeks after, maybe like two weeks afterwards, going forward, it can get kind of difficult to kind of suss out. Like, what is sleepiness and tiredness and moodiness from being sleepy and what is kind of emergent postpartum depression and anxiety? And so that's when it's really important. I know you're talking about the village, but that's really important to kind of get feedback from your village as well about how you're doing. Like, are you seeming like you're kind of getting a little bit back to your normal self, or maybe not, and Are there reasons for that? And you know, once people start thinking about support, like if after you take those naps, after you get some sleep, you're kind of still not feeling like yourself, and you're still kind of cheerful, and you're still kind of maybe feeling upset, maybe even feeling kind of angry, feeling guilty, all those kind of things that come along with feeling depressed. It can be kind of helpful to start talking to people about how you're feeling and and seeing if it's getting better or getting worse. Anxiety is pretty common as well, like worries that can also be difficult to suss out, because as a new you know, when folks are new mothers, they can have a lot of worries about, am I putting my baby to sleep the correct way, on their back? Is my baby breathing? Like all the things that new moms worry about. But again, if that starts to continue or interfere with other things, or those worries start to kind of creep into other aspects, it can be really helpful to talk to people about what you're feeling. By people. I mean family members. I mean other moms. I mean your doctor, your OBGYN, just to get a sense of, is it improving? Is it getting worse, and is it feeling like it's something more than just kind of normal worries. The other thing that people don't talk about very often is there is something called postpartum psychosis. And so that sounds really scary, but that just means that sometimes moms after they have a baby may experience like hallucinations and delusions. And that is definitely something to talk about as well with your doctor to find out what's going on there, because that is something that can feel really scary, but that is actual diagnosis postpartum psychosis. So we want to make sure that, you know, moms are aware of the things that they can experience, but also know the time frame for for these things too, most definitely, that is super important to throw out there.

Thank you so much. And I guess you know, especially with the last one, how, like, what could happen if postpartum depression and anxiety go undiagnosed. And I know I did not suffer, thankfully, from postpartum depression anxiety, yes, but I know I just wanted to suffer in silence, you know. And it took me like two and a half weeks to tell my husband, like, Dude, I am anxious about everything you know, just silly, silly things. But what happens if these things you know, these diagnosis do go undiagnosed.

Yeah, so like in the in the beginning, like I mentioned that some things are common, some of those worries are common. Am I going to drop the baby? Am I putting the baby to sleep? Right? Tearfulness, being tired, being stressed. If those things continue and they go kind of unsupported, then definitely they can get worse, and they can end up having an impact on the baby or the infant. So as babies grow, they become more social, and they learn from the social cues in their environment. And so when a mom is like isolated or depressed or anxious, they can miss or misinterpret cues from their baby, and that can have an impact on the kids, mood and behavior, their ability to regulate themselves and their attachments, which just means their sense of relationship, security and predictability with their environments. And so the good news, I know you're talking about the village, is that if there are other secure attachments in the environment that are offering stability, care, bonding and predictability, some of that effect can offset some of the negative effect on the kid, and that support of the village can also help the mother in terms of reducing stress or seeking support for depression or anxiety or psychosis does develop, and I like to talk a little bit culturally too, like what that support looks like can depend on what's culturally relevant for the person. So that can be therapists, that can be support groups, that can also be pastors and folks that people are comfortable talking to, anything that can mitigate the impact for the mother, like you mentioned, talking to your husband, like talking to anyone at first, you know, to get those thoughts and things out and kind of figure out what's going on, is a great first step, and then moving into whether more support is needed, always starts with that first step of just talking about it first. And I do want to say, like, isolation makes things worse, yes, and.

Mick was not great. I had my first baby during the pandemic, and it's really easy to be like alone with your thoughts about the world falling apart. And I also know that people had to be really creative in how they utilized their village during the pandemic, but definitely it's really important to talk to someone, whether it be someone close to you and your family or your doctor, to kind of figure out, you know, to get those thoughts out of your head and figure out where they're coming from.

Kaile Hunt 10:30
And how can having a village so like friends, family, even neighbors, I'm assuming, during the pandemic, how can that help when it comes to maternal mental health?

Dr. Amber Landers 10:39
Oh, definitely. Social support is so helpful. So I like to come back to this idea of what's culturally and individually relevant for folks, because a person's village is kind of subjective. So like you said, it could be family, friends, it can be support groups, it could be delegating tasks to whoever. But the practical part and the social support are really helpful in supporting maternal mental health. The practical stuff would be finding someone or a neighbor to bring you food or cook for you, or anything that can reduce some of that extra day to day activities that kind of have to continue, but no one has the energy for that. Can also be very stressful to be thinking about how messy your house is, your refrigerator is empty because you haven't gone to the grocery store. If there are practical supports, people who can bring you groceries and not even just bring them, but cook it for you, that can reduce so much stress, which can be really great for mental health. The social support part is also important, as we talked about previously, not being alone with those thoughts and letting them kind of ruminate in your head about the worries and things like that, it's helpful to find folks to talk to. They can be other mothers. They can be your partner. Again, I keep going back to that. Could be your OB, GYN, or your doctor, just anyone that you can get those thoughts out of your head. Because isolation is really the worst thing that can impact kind of maternal mental health and why the village is so important to kind of interrupt any isolation as well as offer those practical supports for folks to be able to mitigate any mental health concerns that might have happened. Most

Kaile Hunt 12:20
definitely, I know for me, because I was in Hawaii when I gave birth to my daughter and my family. Both me and my husband are from California. We didn't have a lot of people. We had moms in my birth class, which was so helpful, because we all pretty much gave birth around the same time. And then I really relied on my Doula, so she was my birth doula, and then she, you know, was my postpartum doula. She came three times for two hours each, and we just sat and chatted. And that really was my village for the first six weeks of postpartum which was so helpful. My doula, which was also really nice, was Polynesian. So she would bring tinctures, she would bring sourdough bread. She would tell me what to do that her ancestors used to do, which I thought was so beautiful. And I know your professional interest is working on or working on minority ethnic mental health. Can you talk a little bit about that in regards to working with mothers and how maybe, you know, depending on where you give birth, is how your postpartum goes, you know, I'm assuming, obviously, for me, in Hawaii, there was a lot of Polynesian culture influenced and that was beautiful. But if I gave birth, you know, in the Bay, which is where I'm from, it would be a little bit different.

Dr. Amber Landers 13:28
Yeah, definitely. I think it's really important to kind of honor people's kind of cultural connections. When I was pregnant with my son, and I went to some classes, there were some things that folks were saying that didn't really resonate with me. One of the things was, don't let anybody come over like, spend your time bonding with the baby. Don't have any visitors. And I'm like, my mom is living with me for at least a month. Help out, clean and cook like I'm not locking my doors. And before, I was pregnant before the pandemic, and then I had a baby during so this advice was coming before the pandemic, saying, like, lock yourself in and don't let anyone in. I'm like, No, that doesn't really resonate with me culturally. I do want my mom to be there, and so it is important to to think about culturally, what is important to you and who is your village. I know some folks might be stressed by having their mom come live with them, and maybe they have their mother in law or somebody else, and that's those are individual choices that I think are important to honor. And so my research, I'm really interested in kind of the system level of things, and I'm really interested in understanding the health disparities that affect ethnic minority mothers, especially in terms of health care. And when we talk about health care, there are some really scary statistics that I'll I mean, I'll share a few that I'll talk about the more positive side, that the rates of of infant and Mother mortality are really a lot higher for black mothers in particular, compared to white mothers. And so that's something to be um. Um, I guess, aware of when we're talking about the stress that mothers might have, especially ethnic minority mothers coming into the birthing experience in pregnancy. And so we don't exactly know why that's the case, and people tend to look at things like income level, health and nutrition, but it's only part of the story. And as a person who's generally healthy myself, who has a PhD, who worked in hospitals, I myself was almost one of those statistics, and I was still shocked. Even though I knew this research intellectually, I did not know how much it would impact me personally. And so I do think it's really important to hear the stories of mothers, especially ethnic minority mothers, so that we can better support them, understand what's going on in their health care, understand what they're worried or stressed about, so that we can also help them advocate. I want to help folks tap into their cultural resources, like today, we're talking about villages, but also any other cultural resources that can be helpful. You talked about your Polynesian doula, and just really want to help people advocate. And so the research that I'm working on right now is doing interviews with particularly black mothers about their experiences with childbirth in medical settings in particular, and what recommendations that they have based on their own experiences, whether they were good or bad to offer back to folks who would be working with other mothers, and so I'm working on that project with a student of mine and a colleague of mine, and it's really exciting to me because it kind of reflects on my personal journey, but also really wanting to highlight the voices of ethnic minority mothers and their experiences.

Kaile Hunt 16:40
You are just doing great work. I am so inspired for you. This is awesome. I kind of want to invite you on another episode to talk about that. That is amazing, and thank you for sharing too.

Dr. Amber Landers 16:51
If anyone's interested, who's listening, who wants to be interviewed, they can always reach out to me too to be research study. Perfect, perfect.

Kaile Hunt 16:59
Yes, we will link your website and maybe your email address, and then people can reach out. Well before we talk anymore, let's take a quick break, and then when we come back, we're going to be interviewing destiny.

Welcome back. We are continuing the topic on finding that village for new moms, postpartum moms, and even moms of infants. And so first question, I'm going to toss it over to destiny. Tell me, you know, I know you have a very, very young son in the house right now, but how did you find your village? And kind of Where did you find your village? Did you rely heavily on friends, on family, on coworkers, kind of walk us through that.

Destani Lena Gerbrandt 17:43
Yeah. So my doulas, they were actually my birth doulas. And then postpartum doulas also, they facilitate a birth circle, and so just having a space to come and be able to just talk through all the things, because sometimes you're like, I don't know if this is normal. Is he crying too much? Am I going crazy? You know, I'm like, What is too much? I don't know what's going on. So it was nice to have a space with other new moms, but also with doulas, who have a lot of experience, who could, like, speak life into us in those moments that was far and above, and just getting that space of feeling like I had some support in a time that feels just kind of all over the place.

Kaile Hunt 18:29
Definitely, you knit the hill the nail on the head is all over the place. And for some moms, their baby doesn't sleep at night, so then you're really up at night and then trying to sleep in the day. But then it's like, do I try to get my, you know, kids sleeping through the you know? So there's so much to go through for me, specifically, you know, what was helpful for my village, which was my Doula, my newborn mom friends and my husband? What was helpful for me? It was I and I like that you said destiny, that it was hard for you to ask for help normally, until you become a mom, and I feel like you're always but for me, I never asked for help. I just kind of sucked it up and did it. And so that was a big hurdle for me, was to ask my husband, like, Hey, can you hold our daughter so I can shower, and can you hold her in a different room? If I feel like just being next to her, she just wants me, you know, like she can smell me, even though I'm just a wall away showering, and so that was, like a big step. Was to have him, you know, take her and downstairs into the living room, or even I remember vividly, I don't know maybe I was four or five weeks postpartum. I just needed to, like, get out of the house. And so again, my husband, who is an amazing caregiver, you know, was like, Here, go to Ross, really quick. Just go to Ross, you know, and just buy something and so little things like that, because I didn't have friends and family, you know, for me, it was my husband kind of making me do stuff like, go take a shower. I got our daughter, or go to get a Starbucks drink really quick. I got her even as simple as, hey, go take a walk like you love walking. You love the sun. Go. Take a walk. And so for me, that was super helpful. My question for you, Destiny is what you know postpartum help helped you. You know, because every mom is different.

Destani Lena Gerbrandt 20:11
I mean, I think the first was definitely like you said, my husband did very similar where once he he stayed home for four weeks, which was amazing, and then when he went back to work, he would come home and he's like, You have to leave the house for an hour. Yep, wherever you go. So to you, do you want to go to yoga? Do you want to go get your nails or toes done? Do you want to walk around Target like you have to go and you're going by yourself? And that was so big for me, of just like, Okay, I'm starting to feel like I have a piece of me still, and that was huge. The other was my mom helped so much with, yeah, those beginning stages when he's not sleeping through the night, she would just come in the morning, I would feed him, and then we would just go back to sleep and and that was a godsend to be able to say, like, Okay, I know someone's gonna be here caring for him. I just need sleep. The beginning, it was always this. Sleep was a big one for us. We're still getting all of the kinks out of like, oh, laundry and dishes and all that. So, you know, sometimes the house is a little messier than we'd like, and all those things, but just being able to have sleep and space, to be able to care for him was honestly our biggest thing. I

Kaile Hunt 21:29
love that. I actually you brought back a memory, speaking of, you know how you're in a newborn haze, and then you know, your kid grows up, and you kind of forget a lot, but that reminded me I didn't do dishes for like, four months. Honestly, my husband just did them, and he stayed home for a very long time. The military is very generous, gave him 12 weeks off, and so he stayed home the whole 12 weeks. And I'm telling you, like the first four months, he even went back to work for a month, and I still just did not do dishes. I just it was just not high for my priority list. And so relying on him to just do it and not complain was lovely. And I remember I would even apologize, like, I'm sorry. I know I didn't do the dishes, but, you know, we just got tack napped all day. I tried to go out and get a walk, and he's like, don't even worry about it. Like, I am not even concerned about that. Dr landers, for you, what tips would you have for newly postpartum moms, especially when they are dealing with multiple so, I mean, kind of, I want to talk a little bit about your kid. You have two kids, you know, and so when you welcomed your second you had a toddler. Yes,

Speaker 1 22:34
yeah, my mom back that second time as well, this day for a month. But I think it goes back to, I mean the social support and the practical support. So the social support is, yes, the people that you can talk to, the people that you can go to for advice, but the practicality like the folks that are gonna bring you food and cook for you and wash your dishes and just hold the baby while you take a nap or take a shower, like you said, in the other room, so that you don't feel guilty, and so that they don't smell you like all those things felt maybe doubly important with the age of my children. And so I do think with folks that have multiple children, there is this idea that somehow you are an expert now and that it's okay if that's not true for you, it's absolutely okay, because each experience might be different. Your birthing experience might be different, your recovery might be different. What you need might be different, and the personalities and temperament of your baby might be different. And so I know for us, we had gotten to a routine with the first kid, and then the second one was very different. And I think you were talking about like dishes and cleaning and things like that. Self Compassion, I guess, is really important regardless. But also when you have multiples, because things may not be exactly the way they were the first time around. You may not feel like that expert that maybe the commercials make you think you should feel like now that you had the second kid, and that is okay, that is completely normal, and you're still going to need those social supports and those practical supports as well.

Kaile Hunt 24:16
I love that. And then destiny, I guess my question for you is you are almost out. I mean, I think the newborn phase is around 12 weeks, right? You were just now getting out of that. What specifically helped you? So when, like, a friend would text you, or your mom would text your mother in law, what did you love that people did, and what were some things that you're you kind of wish people didn't do? And speaking on my own example, my mother would send me Starbucks. Would text me in the morning, like, Hey, what's your order? I'm going to send you something. And then for me, what I found not helpful is, like, college friends who have no babies would say, Oh, can I come visit? What can I do to help? And it's like, one, I'm in Hawaii. Two, no, I don't think that's going to be helpful. You know? Thank you. For reaching out, but, you know, so for you, um, what were super helpful things that you know, you think a lot of people should do to friends and family who have a newborn, and what are some things that you know, mean? Well, right? Great intentions, but kind of, you know, bring more stress. Yeah,

Dr. Amber Landers 25:14
definitely. I

Destani Lena Gerbrandt 25:15
have, like, a really close group of girlfriends, and not all of us have kids, but they are like, you know, my like, ride or dies. So they're our family. And the best thing that they did for me is they didn't ask if I needed help. They just, like, came with support. Yes, I if you ask me, Hey, do you need anything today? I'm gonna say no, fine, even though I'm drowning, right? And so they would just text me and say, Hey, I'm coming. It can look like A, B or C. What does that look like? Do you need me to do you want me to drop off food? Do you want me to come hold the baby? Do you want me to go on a walk? You choose one. And I think that was really helpful for me in those stages of being like, Okay, well, they're coming. I'm not asking and, like, really getting that support. I think on the flip side of that is, like the things that weren't super helpful were like, Oh yeah, I want to come see the baby. Oh, can I come help? Can we do those things? You know, do you need anything today? Because my answers, like I said, always gonna be No, I'm fine. Or, yeah, that was a little tough, too, with some of those like anxieties of having people coming over and being around and like germs and all the things of just like I want to see the baby, oh, I can help while I'm there, was not necessarily the most helpful.

Kaile Hunt 26:35
I so relate to you 100% I love, yeah, when people were specific, like, Hey, can I make you dinner? Can I, you know, DoorDash, you some dinner? Uber Eats something? You know, that was so, so helpful. Well, we got more questions coming up, but first, let's take a quick break.

Well, welcome back to newbies. We are continuing our topic on finding that village and speaking about maternal mental health. So we were talking a little bit before the break about mom tips. But where do moms go to make mom friends destiny? I will toss this question over to you. Where do you think mom should go to make some mom friends, especially for you? I mean, the newborn mom friends?

Destani Lena Gerbrandt 27:26
Yeah. I mean, I'm still navigating this. It's something that I'm just like always wrestling with, because I obviously have my friends, and it's just different when you're in the newborn stage. I think the biggest thing has been the birth circles that my Doula set up. They do them every couple of weeks. People can come and you meet moms that are also at different areas of motherhood. But there also tends to be a lot of newborn moms. I know through also my hospital, they had, like, a postpartum group, and they connected people according to, like, you know, weeks postpartum, and that was something that I did in those first weeks, also coming back to just kind of be around other people who are going through the same things. And I have a couple people from that that I still talk to, and kind of like, we have, we can't hang out all the time because we have newborns, send a text and just like, hey, how's it going? And that makes you feel, I think, a lot less isolated in this time. Most

Kaile Hunt 28:30
definitely, I know for me, I took a birth class in person that was outside the hospital, which was amazing, so informative. And like I mentioned earlier in the episode, we all had babies literally within two weeks from each other, so we were definitely in it together. Another great tip I have would be Facebook groups. I really loved Facebook groups. I joined like, a breastfeeding Facebook group, a black mother breastfeeding Facebook group. I co slept with my daughter for quite a bit, and so I joined like, you know, safe co sleeping tips and even transition tips, you know, from others who wanted to transition out of co sleeping into independent sleep. Anyway. So I really, really loved my Facebook groups as well, because a lot of moms would be like, Hey, I have a three month old, or, Hey, I have a two month old, you know. And this is the issue I'm having. And then I could, you know, read those posts and be like, Hey, I also have a two month old at the time, or three month old, and so that is, yeah, great, great. It helped me a bunch. Next question for Dr landers is, okay? So let's, you know, say a mom is listening to this episode and she is loving what we're saying, but then also is like, Okay, I feel like I need extra support, and maybe therapy is that answer for me. I know it can be so overwhelming to try and find the right therapist. So what tips would you have to a mother who is a new mom, you know, who wants to go to therapy but just doesn't really know where to start? What would be your advice for her?

Dr. Amber Landers 29:51
I would say, as a new mom, you've probably been going prior to your your birth of sorry, I would say, as a new mom. Probably been going to your doctor's appointment and your prenatal appointments prior to having your baby. And so an easy place to start is with your PCP or your OBGYN. They can usually refer you. They may even have psychologists, therapists or social workers that work directly in their clinics, who you can talk to one time. If that feels like enough you just want to check in and be like, what's going on? Is this sound normal or multiple times? I just learned that there's a National Maternal Health hotline that's free and confidential from our government with the number is one, 833, TLC, Mama, M, A, M, a. I did not even know that existed. I think that's new. But for folks who might feel like, I don't know, like it's scary to talk to someone, or like you said, it's very difficult to do the whole search of finding a therapist, I think these are two, like, kind of simple, nothing simple when you have a newborn, but these are simpler ways to kind of get that conversation started. So I would say your PCP, your OBGYN, and maybe even this hotline in terms of getting some information and talking to someone on your own time.

Kaile Hunt 31:09
That is great. Yeah, that is great information. And I do think even maybe pushing your PCP or your OB because I know I think most women get that, like sheet of paper and questionnaire and like, you know, even if you answer honestly, I feel like you know they're gonna be like, Okay, well, that's normal, you know what I mean? Like having some anxiety, having a little bit of baby blues. I was told at least is normal, you know. But if you feel like it's not normal for yourself, I love the resources you gave. And I feel like just asking, like, well, I want to talk to someone, even if it's just for one time, you know, that is great information, absolutely,

Dr. Amber Landers 31:42
and I would, I would say even whatever you write on that form, tell your PCP or your OBGYN that you want to talk to someone. So that is a very good point and distinction. Don't wait for them to ask you if you really feel like you want to talk to someone or you just want to check it out. Tell them directly.

Kaile Hunt 32:01
Most definitely, I'd love that you mentioned that. Thank you. Um, well, ladies, this has been great. Last question, really, is, I feel like it's an easy question, but to do it might be kind of difficult, right? Is, um, how to bring up to your partner if you need help? And I feel like, especially in the newborn phase, and even, like, you know, in the infant phase, I remember there's all these regressions, right? Um, the four month sleep regression, and then it's feeding your kid solids at six months, you know. So there's always these little conflicts that come up, you know, in parenting, and it doesn't have to be a bad thing, right? Just little conflicts. So for me, you know, bringing up how my partner can help, especially during the feeding stage, we just really had to talk a lot, you know, we had to talk a lot about what we wanted to do with our daughter and how we wanted to parent her, and what, you know, what foods we wanted to expose her to. And I know when I asked for help way back in the early newborn phase, it was easy to, you know, bring it up for me later on, but that first initial time of bringing it up, like, Hey, I'm struggling. I need you to do more. Because I remember my husband saying, like, I feel like I'm doing a lot, you know, and you don't want to knock on their parenting at all. But anyway, long question, but destiny, you know, what tips do you have for people to try and talk to their partner and ask for more help? And for, you know, moms or the birthing parent, if they feel like it's kind of difficult to do that,

Destani Lena Gerbrandt 33:19
yeah, I think one of the things that really helped us is we just kind of instituted, like, a temperature check your so we would do just kind of like once a week, or every, like, couple of days in the beginning, and now it's yeah, just about once a week as we're getting more into the swing of things. But just being able to just, like, have a time where we sit down and say, like, Okay, where are we at? What's going on? How can I help you more? How are you mentally, spiritually, physically, all of those things, so that we could kind of adjust as we needed. I think it helped having those regular check ins so that there wasn't like, a big build up of me having to say, like, Okay, I need your help. I'm losing it. I still have some of those times I feel like they were a lot further between because we had some time to check in regularly. That really helped us a lot.

Kaile Hunt 34:12
I love that. And last question for you, Dr landers is, where can our listeners, you know, if they want more information, they want to be a part of your research, where can they find you.

Dr. Amber Landers 34:20
They can find me on my email, which is Dr landers, aj@gmail.com they can also find me at the University website, which is alliant.edu and then you can just go to faculty and find my name under L for Landers. And those are the places where I'm where I'm hanging out lately. I

Kaile Hunt 34:46
love that. Well. Thank you both so much for joining me. This was a great episode. I cannot wait for our listeners to check it out and be sure to check out new mommy media.com where we have all our podcast episodes, plus videos and more. More.

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Disclaimer 35:37
This has been a new mommy media production. The information and material contained in this episode are presented for educational purposes only. Stimulus and opinions expressed in this episode are not necessarily those of new mommy media and should not be considered facts. While such information and materials are believed to be accurate, it is not intended to replace or substitute for professional medical advice or care and should not be used for diagnosing or treating healthcare problem or disease or prescribing any medication. If you have questions or concerns regarding your physical or mental health or the health of your baby, please seek assistance from a qualified healthcare provider.